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Thread: Why no dwarf car racing in Fla. for Speed Week!

  1. #1
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    Why no dwarf car racing in Fla. for Speed Week!

    Last night I watched what I believe you call a podcast of the Legend Series running their "Nationals" in association with Car Speed Week in Fla.. Why hasn't a promoter done anything to schedule dwarf cars somewhere throughout the week or have they and nobody has bothered to share on the dwarf car racing website?

    How can you pass up this golden opportunity? Speed Week in Fla. is the gimmick! The people that shared the podcast with me are ex dwarf car racers that I am sure did so to rub it in. I can't blame them in light of Ohio OVDCA going on their 3rd year without asphalt racing. Come on! If this class is going to make it, we need race tracks to host races---promoters to promote.

    Little help here!
    Last edited by dabossohio; 02-25-2017 at 10:09 AM.

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    Senior Member justfreaky's Avatar
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    Re: Why no dwarf car racing in Fla. for Speed Week!

    Most of the people running in the INEX Legends Series are not ex Dwarf Car racers. Nor, do I think it is intended to "rub it in". The Legends Series was created because of Dwarf Car racing. Humpy Wheeler (Yes, NASCAR Humpy Wheeler) took the idea and turned it into a "spec" class. They run under the INEX rules in 8 different countries (that I am aware of) under a spec set of rules. The series is meant to be a stepping stone from karts to the upper classes of racing. The history of the Legends cars is quite interesting. Look it up sometime. INEX is supposed to be Inexpensive racing.

    Legends racing is not without it's problems. It is hard for people in other countries to obtain parts and meet the rules. Dwarf Car sanctioning bodies vary from State to State, track to track and even country to country. There are several sanctioning bodies. You live in Ohio. I live in Montana. I chose to build a Dwarf Car to run in SCCA solo cross (or auto cross) because we have no Dwarf Car racing here in Montana. We have one track that runs Legends cars. It is a very long tow to get to that track. A set of "standardized" rules may, or may not, help the Dwarf car series. It would be hard to run a "national" race without a set of standardized rules.

    Coverage of the event(s) is a whole different story. Besides a track willing to put on such an event; You would need to find someone that would be willing to travel to the event(s) that has the equipment to do the live casts. They need to make a living and eat as well. There are only so many states (in the USA) that are able to host such off season (for most of us) events. How many could afford to tow to Florida, California or Nevada, etc...? Granted, I do think that Speed Week is a great opportunity for any racing body to showcase their stuff!

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    Re: Why no dwarf car racing in Fla. for Speed Week!

    Quote Originally Posted by justfreaky View Post
    Most of the people running in the INEX Legends Series are not ex Dwarf Car racers. Nor, do I think it is intended to "rub it in". The Legends Series was created because of Dwarf Car racing. Humpy Wheeler (Yes, NASCAR Humpy Wheeler) took the idea and turned it into a "spec" class. They run under the INEX rules in 8 different countries (that I am aware of) under a spec set of rules. The series is meant to be a stepping stone from karts to the upper classes of racing. The history of the Legends cars is quite interesting. Look it up sometime. INEX is supposed to be Inexpensive racing.

    Legends racing is not without it's problems. It is hard for people in other countries to obtain parts and meet the rules. Dwarf Car sanctioning bodies vary from State to State, track to track and even country to country. There are several sanctioning bodies. You live in Ohio. I live in Montana. I chose to build a Dwarf Car to run in SCCA solo cross (or auto cross) because we have no Dwarf Car racing here in Montana. We have one track that runs Legends cars. It is a very long tow to get to that track. A set of "standardized" rules may, or may not, help the Dwarf car series. It would be hard to run a "national" race without a set of standardized rules.

    Coverage of the event(s) is a whole different story. Besides a track willing to put on such an event; You would need to find someone that would be willing to travel to the event(s) that has the equipment to do the live casts. They need to make a living and eat as well. There are only so many states (in the USA) that are able to host such off season (for most of us) events. How many could afford to tow to Florida, California or Nevada, etc...? Granted, I do think that Speed Week is a great opportunity for any racing body to showcase their stuff!
    I edited my original post to say "shared with me" the podcast. they know it was a dagger. I never meant to imply all Legend Car racers were ex dwarf car people. That's just stupid to read that into my post. As far as the travel and towing to go to Fla. and have an event like the Legend people just completed, let me remind you they indeed went to Fla. to run. Why wouldn't dwarf cars? I'm sure not all Legend racers traveled there. Only the ones that could afford it but look at the turn out they had. I'm fully aware of the history of the Legend series and Humpy Wheeler's involvement but my guess he had nothing to do with this event. It happened because a promoter saw a way to make money. With that showing, my guess is they are very happy with the entries and gate. They'll do it again. As far as the rules for dwarf cars, many areas either use the core from TULSA or similar sanction. Most of the rules are the same. Dwarf cars could do a national. Just set the rules in advance like everyone does anyway, then promote it with a purse that will give people hope the event would be a good time. If I knew the event was scheduled I would see to it my car met their rules and go. I doubt any rules differences would require a new car to participate.

    If this class of cars is going to make it, you cannot pass up the hype of car speed week in fla. as a way to promote us. I'm a racer. Not a promoter. I'm a businessman but too old to get involved now. There has got to be a younger promoter, possibly in Fla. with a track, that would jump on this. Little help please.

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    Senior Member HM8425's Avatar
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    Re: Why no dwarf car racing in Fla. for Speed Week!

    Dabossohio makes a good point. While watching the Tulsa Shootout and the Chili Bowl a couple of us thought the same thing. Why not have Dwarfs at a show like that. We know that venue is pretty much filled up with cars and time constraints. However, why not attempt an all sanctioning body rules apply "open comp" race that can piggy back a race some where to start. I personally do not know how to get something like that started. If anyone out there has an idea this would be a good forum to start kicking something off. Maybe get some television time for our Dwarf cars and continue to grow the class.

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    Senior Member justfreaky's Avatar
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    Re: Why no dwarf car racing in Fla. for Speed Week!

    No offense taken. I did not mean to imply anything. The rules do differ some from sanctioning bodies. Not always by a lot. Thing is to come up with a set of rules that would not break the bank for most racers. Finding someone that could promote the event... ???
    Like you, I was a businessman also. I'm just to old and don't have the contacts to put on such an event. Would be a kick in the ass though!!! It wouldn't even have to be Florida. Just an event that showcases the cars during speed week. Take advantage of the start of racing season.

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    Re: Why no dwarf car racing in Fla. for Speed Week!

    Quote Originally Posted by justfreaky View Post
    No offense taken. I did not mean to imply anything. The rules do differ some from sanctioning bodies. Not always by a lot. Thing is to come up with a set of rules that would not break the bank for most racers. Finding someone that could promote the event... ???
    Like you, I was a businessman also. I'm just to old and don't have the contacts to put on such an event. Would be a kick in the ass though!!! It wouldn't even have to be Florida. Just an event that showcases the cars during speed week. Take advantage of the start of racing season.
    Absolutely! Good point that it wouldn't have to be in Fla. Look at how the Supercross series strategically scheduled their Atlanta race during car speedweek, then return 2 weeks later for Bike Week in Daytona. That's not luck! With the dwarf cars there are 2 venues to pursue. dirt track and asphalt! Piggyback is the term I couldn't think of but spot on.

    the idea of an event piggybacked to Chili Bowl is an excellent idea.

    If dwarf car racing is going to be considered as a serious mainstay class in this country, it needs to be promoted. Blanket rules might make the job easier but that's not the answer. Blanket rules is an excuse. Michigan, Ohio, Indiana, and Illinois have cooperated for years to even agree on the same tires for the asphalt racers, yet the programs are suffering. Most of this can be blamed on questionable purses but the reality is Legend guys are traveling to Fla. for not much more than a Gator trophy. I believe it was shared they ran 5-7 classes of cars with about 25 cars each class for a guaranteed 2-day event.

    So what's different? One noticable and big difference is the classes! They break things down by driver skill set so the classes can run competitively in packs and give everyone a chance to podium. I'm not saying follow the course of soccer and give everyone a participation trophy. I am saying we need to re-evaluate the need for amateur and pro status as a class breakdown. The second thing to consider is a change of powerplants for smaller engines in lue of the new motors with ECU's and injection being able to produce a large amount of horsepower from a stock motor, let alone a built motor. At least consider it for use in an amateur classification.

    Our local track in Ohio had concerns about the speed we were reaching with the chassis design we all use. I have to admit I don't believe what we're using was intended for an impact at the speeds we were running. It is out of control. I ask the few old guys left what lap times they ran back in the day and most remembered times for poll position being a full second or more slower than we were running present day. That's a huge increase in overall speed. The track owner and other's concerns were noted by the number of ambulance and medivac runs a season. It was effecting the show and he wanted it cleaned up.

    Everyone can pick my comments apart and I don't care anymore but I will leave you with one last thought. There are classes still running and thriving. Why not learn from them what works and use it. The dwarf car class doesn't have to re-invent the wheel. A promoter needs to see the potential in this class and do something about it. I don't care if he gets rich if it brings back dwarf car racing on asphalt to Ohio. Lot of loose chicks out here needing some direction!

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    Re: Why no dwarf car racing in Fla. for Speed Week!

    TUSA used to run both dwarf cars and mod lites at east bay, but the car count didnt warrant keeping a separate class. (tusa rules are pretty much the same for modlites and dwarfs with the exception of the body anyways. I think a lot of the issue with dwarfs is the difference in rules from one side of the country to the other. Everything in the western half of the USA is basically on the same rules, but the pockets of dwarf cars on the eastern side rules dont line up with western states nor the next club 2 hours away. It seems like many dwarf guys are happy to race their area, but arent exactly after driving really far away.

    And if you want to see carcounts for dwarf cars, look at the national events for western states. Carcounts are alive and well on that half, just seems noone really publicizes them too much anywhere. (they do also break down into 2 or 3 different classes)

  8. #8

    Re: Why no dwarf car racing in Fla. for Speed Week!

    we took two dwarfs down to run with mod lites at bubba raceway last week they let us run..

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    Re: Why no dwarf car racing in Fla. for Speed Week!

    Were there other dwarf cars there? Did you know of any dwarf car races while down there you could have attended?

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    Senior Member HM8425's Avatar
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    Re: Why no dwarf car racing in Fla. for Speed Week!

    https://dirtrank.com/
    A state and national points for dwarfs and modlites plus other classes.
    Check it out, uses your track points and rules. This will give our classes the notoriety that we deserve
    I will be joining for sure. It about time our classes get the recognition we deserve.

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    Re: Why no dwarf car racing in Fla. for Speed Week!

    Quote Originally Posted by HM8425 View Post
    https://dirtrank.com/
    A state and national points for dwarfs and modlites plus other classes.
    Check it out, uses your track points and rules. This will give our classes the notoriety that we deserve
    I will be joining for sure. It about time our classes get the recognition we deserve.
    Wish I would have thought about this gimmick. Somebody is on their way to get rich for the cost of mailing out stickers and a mild amount of time maintaining a website. declaring a national points champion without holding any races or develeping any ground rules beyond send me your money. The only two going to be happy are the guy doing it and the guy that gets named #1 at the end of the season. lol

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    Senior Member HM8425's Avatar
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    Re: Why no dwarf car racing in Fla. for Speed Week!

    Quote Originally Posted by dabossohio View Post
    Wish I would have thought about this gimmick. Somebody is on their way to get rich for the cost of mailing out stickers and a mild amount of time maintaining a website. declaring a national points champion without holding any races or develeping any ground rules beyond send me your money. The only two going to be happy are the guy doing it and the guy that gets named #1 at the end of the season. lol
    I support anybody that wants to take the time to work on getting our classes the recognition we have been asking for. If this gets us on our way to getting an annual race like the Daytona deal for legends or the Tulsa shoot out then why not do it.

    Your original post was about missing something, Sonny has started a program something like what IMCA does for their classes that has over time gotten them national recognition.

    So with that being said why shoot down the idea, at least someone did something.

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    Re: Why no dwarf car racing in Fla. for Speed Week!

    Quote Originally Posted by HM8425 View Post
    I support anybody that wants to take the time to work on getting our classes the recognition we have been asking for. If this gets us on our way to getting an annual race like the Daytona deal for legends or the Tulsa shoot out then why not do it.

    Your original post was about missing something, Sonny has started a program something like what IMCA does for their classes that has over time gotten them national recognition.

    So with that being said why shoot down the idea, at least someone did something.
    This ill-fated attempt to award somebody a national championship with no structure to make it legitimate will fuel dwarf car racers against each other. The idea would have merit and possibly work if it had the structure beyond anybody is eligible regardless where you are located and regardless of the rules you run under where you are at. That kind of structure takes time and sets a base of criteria of things that need to be met. Where's the rainbow? Where's the pot of gold for being named #1? I mentioned in my post I was too old to get involved in promoting something but anyone can do what has been mentioned for the soul purpose of taking your money. I'm not too old to take your money if you believe this is the beginning stages of promoting dwarf cars to a higher more desired level. This effort should be the result of a bunch of other elements needed to make the class seriously compete with Legends for track time and recognition.

  14. #14
    Senior Member HM8425's Avatar
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    Re: Why no dwarf car racing in Fla. for Speed Week!

    Quote Originally Posted by dabossohio View Post
    This ill-fated attempt to award somebody a national championship with no structure to make it legitimate will fuel dwarf car racers against each other. The idea would have merit and possibly work if it had the structure beyond anybody is eligible regardless where you are located and regardless of the rules you run under where you are at. That kind of structure takes time and sets a base of criteria of things that need to be met. Where's the rainbow? Where's the pot of gold for being named #1? I mentioned in my post I was too old to get involved in promoting something but anyone can do what has been mentioned for the soul purpose of taking your money. I'm not too old to take your money if you believe this is the beginning stages of promoting dwarf cars to a higher more desired level. This effort should be the result of a bunch of other elements needed to make the class seriously compete with Legends for track time and recognition.
    Then step up and do something.

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    Re: Why no dwarf car racing in Fla. for Speed Week!

    Quote Originally Posted by HM8425 View Post
    Then step up and do something.
    Read what I wrote.

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